hive inspections?

jl · May 29, 2007, 10:21:21 PM

I am new to bee keeping. This is my first year and I've been checking my first hive body once a week. I started with a three pound package of bees from the south and an Italian queen. I live in the Northeast US and the weather has been for the most part cold, rainy and windy with a few nice days. I'm using an entrance feeder and the bees are still taking the syrup. I've observed alot of bees bringing in pollen and just two days ago noticed capped honey. I've found eggs, the queen, capped and un-capped brood everytime the last two inspections. (eggs since the queen was relased from the cage) There are more bees than I started with also. Last week I found the start of two queen cells about an inch from the top of the comb. I removed them. Two days ago, I found the start of two queen cells right at the bottom of the comb. I removed these also. The queen is laying in a very tight pattern and there are alot of eggs and brood of various stages. Five of the ten frames have been drawn out completely (both sides) and the bees have started drawing out the ones on either side of this, so I'm getting ready to add my second hive body when seven are completely drawn and I am wondering about a couple things. After the second hive body has been added to I do still check the frames in the lower hive body or just the top one? (and how do I do that?) And have I been doing the right thing in removing the queen cells. I appreciate any help!

MrILoveTheAnts · May 29, 2007, 10:27:56 PM

Sounds right about removing the queen cells. When inspecting you want to check for brood in all stages, and see they are being laid in tight patterns. Capped honey is always good too. Make sure the number of bees seems to be increasing and that there aren't to many drones in the hive. As always, keep an eye out for hive beetles, wax moths, and other pests. Feel free to examine drones for mites as you like.

You probably shouldn't add the second box until they have drawn out another 3 frames. Once a box has 80% development then it's time to add another box.

jl · May 29, 2007, 11:11:18 PM

Thanks for the help. Do I check for the brood pattern on the lower hive body after adding the second? Thanks

MrILoveTheAnts · May 30, 2007, 12:49:54 AM

Couldn't hurt. It's always a good idea to check on the lower box every now and then, but if you can see everything you need to in the upper boxes don't bother. Best not to disturb the lower operation more than you need to.

Jerrymac · May 30, 2007, 01:42:18 AM

Quote from: MrILoveTheAnts on May 29, 2007, 10:27:56 PM
Sounds right about removing the queen cells.

What is your reasoning behind this statement? The location of these queen cells sounds like supercedure and I believe the bees would know if the queen needed replacing better than I would.

MrILoveTheAnts · May 30, 2007, 01:52:30 AM

No need to risk a swarm in the middle of the honey flow, especially for a new package. Five frames fully drawn out by the end of May sounds like they are doing a good job to me.

Of course I would expect at least 2 or 3 full frames to be capped brood of the 5

Michael Bush · May 30, 2007, 07:32:39 AM

>And have I been doing the right thing in removing the queen cells.

I never remove queen cells. If it looks like they are trying to swarm (cells on the bottom of frames, lots of bees, shrinking brood nest) I'd do a split. If it looks like they are trying to supercede (not so many bees, cells up in the middle of the frames) I let them. Removing queen cells, in my experience, almost always results in a queenless hive.

jl · May 30, 2007, 03:31:23 PM

Thanks for the advice. Would it be better for me remove the queen cells, kill the old queen and introduce a new queen? I only have one hive as I'm just starting out and I don't mind the expense of the new queen. If the bees think there is something wrong with the old queen and she needs replacing then I'm better off controlling what genetics I have, right? I would just hate to lose the hive the first year it would be very depressing!

MrILoveTheAnts · May 30, 2007, 03:34:25 PM

I think you're better off letting the bees do it. Do Queen genetics really matter? I thought it depends more on the males that mate with the queen.
Packaged hives as I understand them are simply 3000 or 4000 bees thrown in a box and given a new queen just like the ones you'd buy normally.

pdmattox · May 30, 2007, 03:46:58 PM

If the queen is there and laying well, I would either cut the cells out or like michale bush said and pull those frames and put in a nuc and let them raise the queen. It never hurts to have a queen around.

Kathyp · May 30, 2007, 03:48:46 PM

try not to over think things. it's hard not to mess with what they are doing, but they don't need constant managing. with experience, i am learning, you will know when to step in and when not to. i have not quite gotten there, but i have learned to go back in the house and have a drink of coffee before i try to "fix" things. 9 times out of 10, i leave them alone and they manage just fine :-)

of course, it's that 10th time that will get you! :-\

Michael Bush · May 30, 2007, 11:40:23 PM

>I'm better off controlling what genetics I have, right?

Wouldn't local acclimatized and surviving bees be the best genetics?

jl · May 30, 2007, 11:46:31 PM

I have no idea that's why I asked. I read in a book about not knowing the genetics if you let your bees raise their own queen.

Michael Bush · May 31, 2007, 08:11:43 AM

>I read in a book about not knowing the genetics if you let your bees raise their own queen.

People who write books are big on this. They are also big on destroying queen cells, using chemicals, using excluders, using deeps for brood chambers, feeding constantly, and a lot of other things I think are very bad advice...

TonyBOD · May 31, 2007, 12:35:05 PM

Are you sure these are queen cells?

I'm in northern MA and also new to beekeeping (installed my first package in mid April) and a few weks ago I thought I saw some supercedure cells. I decided not to do anything about them and let nature take its course and I was vigilant for any swarms. I went in this past weekend and found what I thought were queen cells were actually the beginnings of some drone brood that had been built out in its own mass (almost looked like bridge comb with drone larvae). I don't think there were ever any queen cells - just a lack of a trained eye on my part.

I've been limiting my hive inspections to once every 2 weeks and my hive seems to be doing well - lots of brood and after 6 weeks they had drawn out almost all the frames so I added my second box.

My advice would be to sit back and wait. If you get a new queen nature has taken its course, but perhaps you don't have anything to worry about.

Scadsobees · May 31, 2007, 02:29:16 PM

Yup, grab a beer (or your relaxing beverage of choice) and sit out and just watch them fly in and out. I just had a hive supercede a new queen. I don't appreciate it, but they wanted it and I wasn't going to be able to stop them. hives with new queens (and a package queen didn't start out with the rest of the bees) frequently will supercede.

Who knows, you might end up with 2 queens in there for a while.

Rick

jl · May 31, 2007, 07:11:31 PM

well I thank everyone for the advice and help. I think I'm just going to let things happen and stop worrying about. I started this to relieve stress from work not cause more!

jl · June 02, 2007, 06:34:29 PM

inspected today. I'm a moron. What I thought were the start of queen cells, I think are only drone cells. I read on another post about drone cells being built out from the comb. I found numerous cells today closed up and same to the ones I was cutting out. These are surrounded by cells that I believe from the size are drone cells. so once again thanks for the info, but like I said, I'M A MORON.

Brian D. Bray · June 02, 2007, 06:38:20 PM

I object to the term, real moron's don't learn from their mistakes. It is obvious you are learning.

DayValleyDahlias · June 02, 2007, 07:53:14 PM

Repeat after me: "I am not a moron, I am curious human who enjoys nature and I am learning about the life of bees...I am brilliant in every aspect of my life."... :lol: